558 Funding Update

[Xplumberlives]

Typed a long response - got fed up with the whole deal and wiped it all
Just pi$$ed off with Pleming bleating about needing more money from the 'core'
Nothing from me Mr P I'm afraid ..... I'd rather support Andy's genuine hard work with the Lightnings
There comes a point ..................................

Bravo, well said!

[MadNaddy]

This is lifted from the common questions page of the site.

The Trust currently holds only sufficient cash reserves to allow us to trade to the end of November, assuming no extra money comes in.

If we are going to meet the deadlines of another display season, we not only need the money for the work detailed, but to cover the overheads of the support operation behind XH558.

If cashflow decreases to the point no funding is possible beyond this timeframe, the Trust will need to consider giving notice to staff and putting the project into administration. The future would then be very bleak – but we have been here before, surviving due to the support we have been given by those who wish to see XH558 continue to fly.


According to the appeal page cash reserves run out at the end of november, its mid october .
I know people are busy etc,etc but the financial aspect should be sorted why before now, no matter how you dress it up it is another last minute plea for money and anyone with half a brain cell will see through it.

As for is she worth it? 558 is an aeroplane, sheet metal rivetted together and frankly im not so sure it is worth it.

Just let me get this right - is this taken from the FAQ page? IF so this is from LAST year!!!!

[Mayfly]

No Naddy it is taken from the new funding page under 'Common Questions'

http://www.vulcantothesky.org/common-questions

[MadNaddy]

You've got to be kidding me!!!!!



If only things worked when they were put on the screen!

[Exceptionalsleeper]

Hi guys, I hope you are all well?

No Scramble this year, infact I am not helping fund the unjustified wage the VTST management demand!

As much as I love the aircraft, until the current shamble leave, I will not donate nor part with any money!

[Xplumberlives]

Hi guys, I hope you are all well?

No Scramble this year, infact I am not helping fund the unjustified wage the VTST management demand!

As much as I love the aircraft, until the current shamble leave, I will not donate nor part with any money!

Bravo, I don't think you are the ONLY one with that viewpoint!

I hope that after all the GOOD WORK that you and your Father undertook last year, it would be nice to see the Management take notice of your views!

[Flipflopman]

Ah, welcome to the other side, Steve!!

I wondered how long it would take

[Dan4th]

Welcome BACK, Steve........

You were a lot of fun to have around way back in

FEBRUARY!

Danf.

[Mayfly]

isn't a shame so many end up feeling they same way!!

[Xplumberlives]

isn't a shame so many end up feeling they same way!!

YeYs it is isn't it!

[Mayfly]

isn't a shame so many end up feeling they same way!!

YeYs it is isn't it!

or even 'Yes'..

[Xplumberlives]

isn't a shame so many end up feeling they same way!!

YeYs it is isn't it!

or even 'Yes'..

Madam the EXTRA Y was in response to your first post!!!!!

[Wedgy]

I think I will try and force myself NOT to read TVOC forums for a while .... they are just irritating me with regard to the funding and especially the posts of someone who's initials are sequential in the alphabet.

Having a final piece of work outstanding with the club, my heart is telling me to give up - considering all the ineptitude and interference from the Trust ... why bother? I do I need this shit? But my head is tapping into my professional side .... complete what you started!
How some professionals within the club/trust cope with this day in day out - god knows! They are better people than I ......

Seeing a lot more people being vocal about their reluctance to pay the salaries of those hinder the project is both heartening and saddening at the same time. Heartening as more and more people are seeing through the 'spin', saddening that this number will just grow and grow until something is done and only one Lady will suffer

Having said all that, I'm sure for every inept person drawing a salary/reimbursement from the funds, there are an equal amount who deserve every penny they receive who work against all the odds and red tape.

[Hungry Haggis]

Having read the TVOC open to the public facing part of the forum on Website announcements and seen this bit Given there appears to be an increasing amount of vociferous club members on another forum who have stated they wont donate another penny, I wonder whether we'll ever see the Vulcan flying again.

We've just come off the back of a very successful season, but if club members wont back the cause, what hope is there? copied in full from the newsletter thread .I dread to think what is going on in the members only bit {I can't read and don't really want to know}. While I had access There was a load of squabbling and infighting regarding who should pay for 558 etc .My point being the infighting etc still looks as rife as ever .I sure hope the bitterness that comes across with this statement stays of this forum. People who are in a position to pay I'm sure will continue to do so at a level they will be able to afford Or if they have to suspend paying they will . My other point is this as said this is from a increasingly negative looking thread that is open to public view I have not read the full thing but those kind of comments could well stop a casual visitor from donating ,what looks like much needed funds .I sure would not like to read that Smiler and crew have been put on notice yet again there is no person that could or even should go through that threat year after year when they put so much into something they truly believe in .Having said this I think The trust etc should get their act fixed and instead of bumbling their way through each season for funds sort out this issue and start at the beginning of each and every season raising funds for the following one if they don't I can see one time they come out with the if this amount isn't raised by X date 558 wont fly next year really coming true . I'm certainly no financial whiz but going by the newsletter thingy I gather they seem to have around 2/3rds of what they need either in place or identified ,if this is correct then it can be done ,remains to be seem if it will .In the meantime my small amount will continue to help .

OK thats my small Rant over but please can we not have the squabbling spilling over to here That kind of issue really turns me OFF.

[Exceptionalsleeper]

Ah, welcome to the other side, Steve!!

I wondered how long it would take

Didn't take long hey Ron?

Okay, I was naive to an extent in thinking the Trust was a professional outfit, being privy to the information I was and still am from a good source (a mutual friend) leaves me bewildered!

[Dee]

Well i keep putting my £10's in, since losing my job at Xmas and not having worked since due to back problems my money is very hard to come by as i no longer get any help from the Government.. So i must admit i was astounded to read that Steven isn;t helping 558 anymore, due to wages being paid to whoever.. I have no idea what is going on in that respect. So do i keep my money to myself, what little bit i have or do i help 558?? No brainer really, ill keep giving what i can.

[Mayfly]

and no-one here would tell you not to Dee. Everyone must decide for themselves wether they wish to contribute or not - I confess I no longer put money into the pot & I don't volunteer to help at airshows either - I offered to help with loads of things in the past & my offers were always ignored. I do however help the club with other things if I can & often suggest contacts I think may be of help to them via a third party, but thats all now sadly.

[Exceptionalsleeper]

As Pam said, it is your decision to donate, I choose not too. And to further stress my reasons why, the wage the management demand and the cock-ups of the management such as the PtF at Waddington, I have just lost faith. My gripe isn't with the Club, only the Trust.

[PhantomAviator]

i have a few simple opinions

i knew about this appeal, and roughly what the required amount was, a few weeks ago. in my opinion, it IS worth the effort, although i will not disguise the fact that i will NOT be donating any money. my reason is simple - I've long been frustrated being begged to help pay the salaries of those who i think should be fired, but the last few weeks have compounded that for me. i will NOT contribute to the salaries of those who've been obstructive to 558's future.

sadly, this also means that those who DO deserve to keep their jobs will not receive my support either, and for that i can only apologise.

the sad thing is that there ARE some extremely capable people who DO understand what 558 and VTS are genuinely about, and how the business should be run.

in short, Dr Pleming needs to go, as does Mr. Edmondson, before 558 truly has a chance of thriving.

sm

Whilst I agree with most of your post, I must say I disagree with the 2nd part of your last sentence.
To my knowledge Mr Edmondson has given up much of his own time to support the project from the start.

I think that what a majority of us do not believe is that the maths have been done correctly.
The appeal is for £400,000 now and £400,000 before the Th birthday.
But if we take the past few years into account these amounts are going to rocket and (IMO) they will rocket to something like £1,400,000.
Look at last year. It was claimed that they needed £50,000/£60,000 @ month which was then claimed to be £1,000,000+ for the year. Now I know my maths may be a little rusty, (or they were last year) but £50,000/£60,000 @ month I get to equal £600,000/ £720,000 for the year.
So taken against last years calculations you can almost double what they are asking for.

Another point is after all the time at Bruntingthorpe to give the support they have had a Big Thank You, they announced that once she left for the display season she would never be returning. Didn't even give a bow out.

She left to no permanent home to go to. If it wasn't for the support of the RAF she still wouldn't have a home.
Even the one she has been offered in C2 Hangar at Lyneham is only a temporary one.
She will as it stands at present need to be away from Lyneham before the new season starts next year.
So where will she be going then?

When she does get a permanent home, How much will that cost?
More than is being budgeted for.

I think there are still a Lot of questions unanswered and we will not be told them until it is crunch time.

Lastly, with the threat of redundancy engineers left last time.
I feel sure that many will leave this time, because they cannot afford to put up with the 'Will we have a job or not'.

This will then cause the problem off her not seeing the next season as the engineers have to be certified by Marshall's.

End of gripe for now.

[Saracenman]

Whilst I agree with most of your post, I must say I disagree with the 2nd part of your last sentence.
To my knowledge Mr Edmondson has given up much of his own time to support the project from the start.

so? very many of US have given up considerable amounts of our own time as well. we don't get a VTS salary!

giving up any amount of time doesn't automatically make someone good at their job!

i genuinely believe that Dr. Pleming just doesn't have the FIRST idea just how much goes on behind the scenes by some very dedicated and passionate volunteers. he may say "thank you" from time to time but, on more than one occasion, he's been prompted to do so! even then, he still fails to see just how much has been achieved by people he doesn't even know!

sm

[Wedgy]

As Mayfly and Exceptionalsleeper have stated, everyone has their own choice

I chose to vent on IA and not on TVOC because I know here, we can have a discussion and express our opinions WITHOUT it turning into a slagging match of "I'm right and you're not" or a pissing contest of "I'm a better club member than you are". I did reply to a thread on TVOC forums and decided to delete it immediately as history suggests it would just cause the thread to degenerate further as per the above

Its really great that people like Dee still have faith and are willing to dip into their pockets continuously .... but I fear those in that number are dwindling

[Pujgnie]

Well.. I for one am not giving up on 558.

My Standing Order stays put - and I will donate when I can. The project has come too far for me to walk away from personally.

Having seen the joy on peoples faces at 558's arrival at Bournemouth this year - just makes it worthwhile. I agree that the timing of the appeal is bad.. ie after the airshow season has finished. I will do my bit for her where I can.

We have been in this situation before.. and no doubt will be again. Without a major sponsor on board - it is down to us... her life blood to keep her going - until a sponsor steps foward. I do not wear rose tinted glasses - but walking away from her now is NOT what we need.

Can everyone just have a re-think, watch the videos, the joy of this years displays - before they turn her back on her !!

Whatever peoples gripes are with management, VTTS etc... let's just set it aside for the sake of 558 in 2010.

(I'll shut up now)

[Exceptionalsleeper]

I admire you Pujgnie but too much as gone on this year alone. I have faith in 558 but it is totally lost in the management which is a big issue.

Good luck but in the words of the Dragon's "I'm out!".

[Saracenman]

I'm exactly the same ExS

I'll CONTINUE supporting both the Club, and 558 herself. i will NOT support the salaries of those who stand in the way of 558's progress

558's future lies with a management team lead by someone who knows what they're doing!

sm

[Dan4th]

THEM'S FIGHTIN' WORDS!